29 replies to this topic

[Variant]

What is your suggestion?:

Remove UIM abusing nightmare storage along with an extra storage such as hespori or zulrah.

 

Is this in OSRS?:

OSRS doesn't allow this abuse/bug

 

 

How would this benefit Alora?:

Currently, and for far too long, UIM have been able to abuse nightmare storage since it's a free storage that will never be deleted even if they die elsewhere. This makes the game mode laughable to call 'uim' when they're given so many 'bank' options to store items as is.

 

We should only allow things OSRS allows such as POH, ONE death storage at bosses that OSRS offers, emote clue storage, and looting bag. 

 

I know this has been abused for so long, but we shouldn't allow bugs to remain just because others have abused it. If having storage means that much to these "uim" they should just make regular ironmen instead of 'ironman with extra steps'.

 

This really should be a bug report, but considering its long abuse history I'd like the community to give their input, and all input is valid even if you dont play the game mode. It's not hard to tell objectively this is wrong, and if you want it it's only because you abuse it.

[Selenagomez]

im neutral. could make the game mode more enjoyable to those looking for a more authentic experience but this has been in alora for a while (i think, not sure never played uim here) that it might ruin the game mode for ppl who currently play uim

[GIM SPUDLET]

100% support this!

[Ruwk]

I'm neutral because the issue is that so many UIM already have benefited from it. It almost doesn't make sense to allow new UIM to have the same advantage.


I think introducing HC UIM is a better option - but make that game mode if you die, you become a "Dead" HCUIM, and still get HCUIM XP rates / will lose items if you die whilst your items are in Nightmare storage. This would be a new game mode (that already has a ton of support) so it would create an opportunity for a change like this and an even playing field for everyone.


But overall, I agree that UIM being able to use the Nightmare death storage in this manner is pretty lame and unnatural to the game mode.

[Variant]

I'm neutral because the issue is that so many UIM already have benefited from it. It almost doesn't make sense to allow new UIM to have the same advantage. I think introducing HC UIM is a better option - but make that game mode if you die, you become a "Dead" HCUIM, and still get HCUIM XP rates / will lose items if you die whilst your items are in Nightmare storage. This would be a new game mode (that already has a ton of support) so it would create an opportunity for a change like this and an even playing field for everyone.

There's plenty of people who have benefited off bugs alora has had in the past and haven't had their progress removed, but we still fix it.

 

Some examples: Barrage hitting multi targets in inferno (no infernal capes removed), phoenix pets from fming (phoenix pets werent removed), ahkka not attacking 2/4 phases (toa purples/kc werent removed), keris of the sun working outside of toa (anywhere others used it kc wasnt removed), etc.

 

Just because something is bugged for a long time, doesn't mean it should go ignored, or unfixed, it's also treated as some sort of secret amongst the UIM community (with only some light being shared here and there on forums) because they know they don't want this bug abuse to be fixed. I don't understand why someone who chooses to have no bank, wants so much extra storage space, makes no sense, and it ruins the integrity of the game mode for all those who haven't abused this bug.

[Siuuu]

No support from me. It seems like this has just become a natural part of the game for the Ultimate Iron Man game mode. We should see it as a feature on Alora, not a bug. If it was a big deal, people would have mentioned it ages ago, like a year or even 4 years back. When/if the Hardcore Ultimate Iron Man is released, tougher rules are definitely a necessity.

 

I don't understand why someone who chooses to have no bank, wants so much extra storage space, makes no sense, and it ruins the integrity of the game mode for all those who haven't abused this bug.

Many people share the same opinion about players who go for the Group Iron Man game mode to trade, buy, and sell items with others.

[Variant]

No support from me. It seems like this has just become a natural part of the game for the Ultimate Iron Man game mode. We should see it as a feature on Alora, not a bug. If it was a big deal, people would have mentioned it ages ago, like a year or even 4 years back. When/if the Hardcore Ultimate Iron Man is released, tougher rules are definitely a necessity.

 

Many people share the same opinion about players who go for the Group Iron Man game mode to trade, buy, and sell items with others.

It's definitely a bug lol seeing it as a 'feature' is just because they dont want it removed. It should have been fixed ages ago, but im sure no one has reported it since they love the benefit of playing ironman with the uim logo for some odd reason. If you want to play ironman with over 100+ slots then play the regular game mode and stop with this weirdness/bug abuse.

 

Playing "whataboutism" is just an awful look, but I 100% agree that GIM should not be able to trade, and if they did (like it's allowed in OSRS), they should receive a green helm. I even made a suggestion about this but it hasn't gone anywhere since tracking those who have traded would be an almost impossible task I imagine. Let's not get off topic of this suggestion though, if you feel like gim should change feel free to make a ;;suggestion.

[A UIM]

Im neutral on this.

On one hand, yes it is quite OP to be able to have a small bank of sorts, and in the spirit of UIM it shouldnt really be in the game.
But at this point its been around how long? And I see it as more of a core feature to the Alora specific  QOL UIM experience rather than a specific bug such as the ones mentioned above.
While it does allow you to bank of sorts, it still requires you to juggle your bag and inventory to make it useful, and while this isnt hard it does still require the use of the intended UIM mechanics.
I'd also feel as its been around so long and so many UIMs have used it, removing it from newer UIMs, and all those after, would impact their ability to have the same game mode experience that others in the same mode have had.

On the other hand, if it was removed how would UIMs deal with the sever issues which can kick people offline for over an hr at a time? The generic way for UIMs to do wildy content is to death pile, which lasts 60 mins, and then panic run to the wildy for 45 mins or so and then re-pile. In the event you death pile, and the login server goes down and you loose your whole bank, would it be returned? If so how long would it take? and if so this would also put additional work on Omi? who I assume is the only one who can spawn & trade ironman accounts - correct me if I'm wrong and Admins can also do this.


TL'DR - if It changed UIMs would survive, if it didnt UIM's would survive so either way.

 
 

[Variant]

On one hand, yes it is quite OP to be able to have a small bank of sorts, and in the spirit of UIM it shouldnt really be in the game.
But at this point its been around how long? And I see it as more of a core feature to the Alora specific  QOL UIM experience rather than a specific bug such as the ones mentioned above.
While it does allow you to bank of sorts, it still requires you to juggle your bag and inventory to make it useful, and while this isnt hard it does still require the use of the intended UIM mechanics.
I'd also feel as its been around so long and so many UIMs have used it, removing it from newer UIMs, and all those after, would impact their ability to have the same game mode experience that others in the same mode have had.

 
 

I'd be willing to bet a majority of new uim dont know this is a thing, until another uim tells them, in which case it wont effect most new uim because they start the game mode expecting it to be like it is on osrs. This, if anything, can be discouraging because uim have a safe bank, with 1 or 2 extra steps, which completely ruins the integrity of the game mode.

 

 

On the other hand, if it was removed how would UIMs deal with the sever issues which can kick people offline for over an hr at a time? The generic way for UIMs to do wildy content is to death pile, which lasts 60 mins, and then panic run to the wildy for 45 mins or so and then re-pile. In the event you death pile, and the login server goes down and you loose your whole bank, would it be returned? If so how long would it take? and if so this would also put additional work on Omi? who I assume is the only one who can spawn & trade ironman accounts - correct me if I'm wrong and Admins can also do this.

 
 

They will handle the same issues of being kicked off-line just like everyone else? Imagine arguing this to a hardcore, where it's very unlikely to get a status refunded. YES uim lose items that WILL be refunded, and will take as long as it needs to just like EVERYBODY else this effects, just like any other game mode who loses items in those down times, so this point is very mute...

[A UIM]

 

They will handle the same issues of being kicked off-line just like everyone else? Imagine arguing this to a hardcore, where it's very unlikely to get a status refunded. YES uim lose items that WILL be refunded, and will take as long as it needs to just like EVERYBODY else this effects, just like any other game mode who loses items in those down times, so this point is very mute...

 

My issue with this is it would take days? week+? for Omi to have the time to log in and spawn an entire accounts items 1 by 1 and then trade them to a the player. The mans busy and it can take days to repond to donation messages and other items ( no fault at all of his own, again hes busy ) but an account loosing everything they own and more or less making it unplayable is a lot different to other players who loose a few items, or a HC status which doesnt impact gameplay at all.
I'm not arguing that the items wouldnt be refunded, I assume they would, its the massive impact of they having to be in the first place thats the issue.

[Variant]

My issue with this is it would take days? week+? for Omi to have the time to log in and spawn an entire accounts items 1 by 1 and then trade them to a the player. The mans busy and it can take days to repond to donation messages and other items ( no fault at all of his own, again hes busy ) but an account loosing everything they own and more or less making it unplayable is a lot different to other players who loose a few items, or a HC status which doesnt impact gameplay at all.
I'm not arguing that the items wouldnt be refunded, I assume they would, its the massive impact of they having to be in the first place thats the issue.

I mean just like everyone else who loses key items to game play when they die bossing with all their gear due to these disconnects? I don't see why uim should be given privelage or treated special because of it, the issue is the server not being stable, which I believe should/is fixed by now hopefully.

 

Also that's really really REALLY crazy for you to say losing your hc status doesn't effect game play as if most wont just outright quit if they lost it.

[A UIM]

I mean just like everyone else who loses key items to game play when they die bossing with all their gear due to these disconnects? I don't see why uim should be given privelage or treated special because of it, the issue is the server not being stable, which I believe should/is fixed by now hopefully.
 
Also that's really really REALLY crazy for you to say losing your hc status doesn't effect game play as if most wont just outright quit if they lost it.

Sorry I misread your last comment, are HC status not replaced when a server side crash causes them to loose it?? If so that's a whole other issue.
If a HC looses status with their own DC, that's the HC life, but if a server crash causes it, as we are talking about here, that should 100% be refunded.

And my point was more that a UIM would loose their entire accounts worth of items, which could take who knows how many days to replace, whereas any other account type looses max 1 gear set? And still has options to do just about anything else in game in the mean time.

I'm not fighting for or against the NM bank, but I think in the current state removing it would be overall worse for UIM than better. If there's UIMs who don't want to use it to have a more realistic experience they are not forced to.

[Variant]

And my point was more that a UIM would loose their entire accounts worth of items, which could take who knows how many days to replace, whereas any other account type looses max 1 gear set? And still has options to do just about anything else in game in the mean time.

it could be multiple gear sets if they hybrid/tribridding a boss, sadly omicron is the only one handling these refunds so it can take time, but that's already happening as is right now just with every other item vs just the ones NM holds, not to mention their poh and clue stash items are still safe, so it's not like the entire acc is wiped and they just bank stand til they can get anything back. Just like the ones who lose their key items, they have to wait and it is what it is, uim shouldnt be able to abuse a bug like this just because the off chance alora gets knocked down, even if it's more common now than before, it won't always be this common once it's fixed.

 

 

I'm not fighting for or against the NM bank, but I think in the current state removing it would be overall worse for UIM than better. If there's UIMs who don't want to use it to have a more realistic experience they are not forced to.

but we both know the spirit of the game is meant to be played as close to osrs as possible, and this bug was never intended to be a thing. I'll say again, if uim want a bank so bad, just play the normal ironman game mode. It's a joke to have 80+ storage items on a game mode of "just my inventory", and on top to have what 40ish items be 100% safe at all times? And asking people to just stunt their acc because others want a bug is wrong, with that logic why not just let any bug abuse fly, and if anyone wants to play correctly just dont sip the super restore, or skip puzzles in kephri, or safe spot demonic gorillas, etc, etc. just cuz a bug has been around a long time is no excuse to not fix this bug

[H]

No support. It has been around so long to the point where its become an Alora feature, rather than a bug.

[XtU]

No support.

 

I really want to know which UIM hurt you for you to have such a fiery opinion on a pretty widely known & accepted game mechanic for UIMs. Having nightmare storage simply is a QOL, since if it were to not exist, you could still death pile and do whatever you were going to do anyway, albeit without 10 extra steps beforehand. Just say that you don't agree with it and move along lmao. This almost directly falls in line with why GIM's can still buy/sell items or why HCIM have extra safe deaths, it's been around for years and has been accepted and it's simply too late to revert for the sake of the server. 

 

I was lowkey hoping that when I read in your initial post that you welcomed all feedback, that this post would create meaningful conversion, but all it has been is you shitting on every post and trying to make people conform to your opinion. Quite frankly, I'm not sure why you care so much about how people play the game lol

[Sassa fras]

I think item retrieval storage for UIM should have the trade-off with risk of wiping, but NM storage has been in the game so long it doesn't make sense to change it now.

[Variant]

 

No support.

 

I really want to know which UIM hurt you for you to have such a fiery opinion on a pretty widely known & accepted game mechanic for UIMs. Having nightmare storage simply is a QOL, since if it were to not exist, you could still death pile and do whatever you were going to do anyway, albeit without 10 extra steps beforehand. Just say that you don't agree with it and move along lmao. This almost directly falls in line with why GIM's can still buy/sell items or why HCIM have extra safe deaths, it's been around for years and has been accepted and it's simply too late to revert for the sake of the server. 

 

I was lowkey hoping that when I read in your initial post that you welcomed all feedback, that this post would create meaningful conversion, but all it has been is you shitting on every post and trying to make people conform to your opinion. Quite frankly, I'm not sure why you care so much about how people play the game lol

 

looks like im the one hurting you, keep doing mental gymnastics all you want, this is a bug and should be fixed. As previous suggestions I've made and supported, I agree if gim trade give them a green helm, if hc's die take away their status, so this 'whataboutism' won't work. Wild how you think this being a BUG is an OPINION, when it's literally a BUG. 

 

If REAL UIM is too hard for you, and you desperately want a place to safely store your items, then feel free to turn into a normal ironman lil bro. Stop getting your panties in a bunch just because finally someone is bringing light to this issue/BUG. I do respect all opinions posted, but that doesn't mean I can't leave a rebuttle. I respect if people FEEL like its a feature, when it's clearly not cuz so were super restores then, but no one's given me a real reason why this BUG shouldn't be fixed other than "i/others want to abuse it for longer because the other guy did for a long time"

[Sassa fras]

looks like im the one hurting you, keep doing mental gymnastics all you want, this is a bug and should be fixed. As previous suggestions I've made and supported, I agree if gim trade give them a green helm, if hc's die take away their status, so this 'whataboutism' won't work. Wild how you think this being a BUG is an OPINION, when it's literally a BUG.

If REAL UIM is too hard for you, and you desperately want a place to safely store your items, then feel free to turn into a normal ironman lil bro. Stop getting your panties in a bunch just because finally someone is bringing light to this issue/BUG. I do respect all opinions posted, but that doesn't mean I can't leave a rebuttle. I respect if people FEEL like its a feature, when it's clearly not cuz so were super restores then, but no one's given me a real reason why this BUG shouldn't be fixed other than "i/others want to abuse it for longer because the other guy did for a long time"

UIM is no banking, it's not just having 28 inventory spaces. Alora UIM is easier than OSRS but then again everything is, so what's the issue?
Can you please explain what a real UIM is to me?

[Variant]

UIM is no banking, it's not just having 28 inventory spaces. Alora is easier than OSRS but then again everything is, so what's the issue?
Can you please explain what a real UIM is to me?

28 inventory spaces + 11 equipable item slots being stored in a safe place where death will not delete them, ON TOP OF storing the same amount of items in a location like Zulrah or Hespori, while also having a looting bag for 28 MORE spaces is wild. 106 slots when in OSRS it's only 67 (not counting clue and poh stuff obv). I actually agree with you, Alora is a lot easier than OSRS, so even more reason why UIM don't need a nm storage. 

 

in my opinion, because that's all this is obviously, a real uim will play the way jagex intended it to be, and as jagex changes, so does what a real uim is. Not making up rules just because players want to play normal ironman with extra steps and pretend to be uim.

[Sassa fras]

28 inventory spaces + 11 equipable item slots being stored in a safe place where death will not delete them, ON TOP OF storing the same amount of items in a location like Zulrah or Hespori, while also having a looting bag for 28 MORE spaces is wild. 106 slots when in OSRS it's only 67 (not counting clue and poh stuff obv). I actually agree with you, Alora is a lot easier than OSRS, so even more reason why UIM don't need a nm storage. 

 

in my opinion, because that's all this is obviously, a real uim will play the way jagex intended it to be, and as jagex changes, so does what a real uim is. Not making up rules just because players want to play normal ironman with extra steps and pretend to be uim.

UIM just means no banking and no trading. That's it.

 

If Jagex didn't want UIM to use other storage methods, they wouldn't allow it. Instead, they have the trade-off of wiping. Alora is much easier than OSRS in all aspects, so I suppose it makes sense to have an item storage with less risk than the normal game. I personally don't like this, so I play with my own restrictions that I find fun (no looting bag and no Item Retrieval).  But it all still fits under the intention of the game mode.

 

If we really want to be pedantic we can always push this further. The "ultimate" ideal UIM would be no Item Retrieval storage, no looting bag, no POH storage, no STASH storage, no Lost Items Manager, and no other way to store anything outside of your Inventory and Equipment. HCUIM restricts most of those, so............ update loc?